Teaser for the New Ultimaker....here we go!

Talk about your experience with Ultimaker printers
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nilrog
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Re: Teaser for the New Ultimaker....here we go!

Postby nilrog » October 18th, 2016, 4:37 pm

Interresting evolution of the Ultimaker concept :)

But in some sense it feels like this is what they once promised, but never finished, for the Ultimaker 2 (dual extrusion). But they now bundled that feature with a lot of other nice features and refinements.

reibuehl
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Re: Teaser for the New Ultimaker....here we go!

Postby reibuehl » October 18th, 2016, 4:49 pm

Yeah! Finally dongle chips for nozzles to prevent stuff like exchangable nozzles. :-(

How much are these per piece - just in case you need a new one after every 5 rolls of CarbonFill?
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MTVDNA
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Re: Teaser for the New Ultimaker....here we go!

Postby MTVDNA » October 18th, 2016, 5:05 pm

I suppose you can still replace the nozzles on them...?

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Re: Teaser for the New Ultimaker....here we go!

Postby reibuehl » October 18th, 2016, 5:13 pm

Not to my knowledge. You are supposed to replace the whole print core as far as I know.
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ivan.akapulko
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Re: Teaser for the New Ultimaker....here we go!

Postby ivan.akapulko » October 18th, 2016, 5:37 pm

Judging by the photos, the brass portion is pressed to another, wich made either of steel or titanium. No way to change.
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MTVDNA
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Re: Teaser for the New Ultimaker....here we go!

Postby MTVDNA » October 18th, 2016, 5:43 pm

At €120 for a print core I honestly can't imagine they're supposed to be disposable...

http://www.makerpoint.nl/en/3d-printing ... r/4241486/

Also it just doesn't make sense to throw the heater, sensor, cooling block, etc., away when all that needs to be replaced is the nozzle.
Last edited by MTVDNA on October 18th, 2016, 5:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Neotko
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Re: Teaser for the New Ultimaker....here we go!

Postby Neotko » October 18th, 2016, 5:45 pm

Well it has a chip, but is far from closed. Even the firmware inside can be edited by ssh to add new cores from aftermaket if so you desire. It has a lot of checks but they don't stop you from printing, it just issues warning and you can continue printing.

Same happens with filament chip, is something to help and not to block, you can use any filament you desire but to dual or pva support prints is just much easier to use their materials and the 300 different groups of settings available for all that ultimaker plastic. But they don't lock or block the user. You can even unplug the chip reader if you want. And the printer now uses a new flavor called 'Griffin' that's quite more straight to the printer and even when the printer can suggest or say 'hey that might go wrong' it doesn't stop or lock you away.

I don't say this as a um fan, but from my experience with it. I would be very mad at them if they did any lock or encryption. All is very straightforward and you can even read the firmware and learn how they write/read the info on the chip.

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ivan.akapulko
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Re: Teaser for the New Ultimaker....here we go!

Postby ivan.akapulko » October 18th, 2016, 5:45 pm

Finally, we all must recognize: UM3 is not a hobby-style printer. He had a different target audience. And there are far more important about timing of response by SLA than the cost of consumables. That does not negate the technical beauty of the printer, and reasonableness of the ecosystem with propietary (I think so, official confirmation has not (yet) happened) plastic, nozzles and other stuff.

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Re: Teaser for the New Ultimaker....here we go!

Postby Neotko » October 18th, 2016, 5:46 pm

MTVDNA wrote:At €120 for a print core I honestly can't imagine they're supposed to be disposable...

http://www.makerpoint.nl/en/3d-printing ... r/4241486/


Well they can sork 280C continuously and I think that their max temp is 350C but that could damage them. So max normal use is 280C and you can go higher at your own risk.

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ivan.akapulko
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Re: Teaser for the New Ultimaker....here we go!

Postby ivan.akapulko » October 18th, 2016, 5:49 pm

Neotko wrote:Well it has a chip, but is far from closed. Even the firmware inside can be edited by ssh to add new cores from aftermaket if so you desire. It has a lot of checks but they don't stop you from printing, it just issues warning and you can continue printing.

Same happens with filament chip, is something to help and not to block, you can use any filament you desire but to dual or pva support prints is just much easier to use their materials and the 300 different groups of settings available for all that ultimaker plastic. But they don't lock or block the user. You can even unplug the chip reader if you want. And the printer now uses a new flavor called 'Griffin' that's quite more straight to the printer and even when the printer can suggest or say 'hey that might go wrong' it doesn't stop or lock you away.

I don't say this as a um fan, but from my experience with it. I would be very mad at them if they did any lock or encryption. All is very straightforward and you can even read the firmware and learn how they write/read the info on the chip.

Any known data about filaments manufacturers enlisted nfc by UM? It can be good idea, if Colorfabb, FormFutura and others enjoy nfc marks as a standard.

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ivan.akapulko
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Re: Teaser for the New Ultimaker....here we go!

Postby ivan.akapulko » October 18th, 2016, 5:53 pm

If the new engine will track the amount of used plastic material by the mark (it should be the unique ID of the spool), then the printer will warn that the current quantity of plastic is insufficient to print if it so.
Last edited by ivan.akapulko on October 18th, 2016, 5:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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ivan.akapulko
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Re: Teaser for the New Ultimaker....here we go!

Postby ivan.akapulko » October 18th, 2016, 5:54 pm

MTVDNA wrote:At €120 for a print core I honestly can't imagine they're supposed to be disposable...

http://www.makerpoint.nl/en/3d-printing ... r/4241486/

Also it just doesn't make sense to throw the heater, sensor, cooling block, etc., away when all that needs to be replaced is the nozzle.

99 at UM Store, but it no make real diffirence, imo. It still too high price for end user.

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Re: Teaser for the New Ultimaker....here we go!

Postby Anders Olsson » October 18th, 2016, 9:53 pm

ivan.akapulko wrote:Judging by the photos, the brass portion is pressed to another, wich made either of steel or titanium. No way to change.


There are threads both in the heater block and in the heatbreak and the nozzle goes right through the block into the heatbreak.
So you can unscrew the nozzle, assuming that you use 7 mm spanner to prevent the heat break from rotating.
If you put too much force on the heat break, like trying to unscrew the nozzle while holding further up on the print core, you will destroy the heat break.

In theory, one could replace the block with something where you can put standard nozzles, but in practice you would destroy the heatbreak when you tighten the nozzle. (That does not mean it is impossible to make an "Olsson block" for the print cores though, I already designed one for my own experiments which I will test shortly :-) )

If you unscrew the nozzle by the way, you must get it back so that the number of threads between the heat break and the block are the same, or it will not work.
The proper way to mount it is to start with the block and the nozzle and add the rest of the components of the core in order.
That however requires some special tooling, just attacking it with normal pliers can work but it will leave scratches on the components.
Last edited by Anders Olsson on October 19th, 2016, 3:57 am, edited 1 time in total.

nallath
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Re: Teaser for the New Ultimaker....here we go!

Postby nallath » October 19th, 2016, 3:52 am

Sorry to keep you all guys from waiting. I'm going to try and answer the questions you guys have about this. I will probably forget a ton of stuff, so poke me again if I missed shit.

We have 2 electronic boards; The ollimex and the "oldscool" control board (thing with an atmega that actually controls the steppers & heaters). This is mostly done to guarantee realtime controls (even if the ollimex crashes, your steppers / heaters will still be controlled!). The Ollimex (indeed with a debian based system) sits in between as a controller unit.

The cartridge/PrintCore chip has memory on it, which is in no way encrypted or locked (I can't stress this enough!). Anyone who feels like it can make their own (and start selling them, if they please). The idea of the printcores is indeed guaranteeing uptime. A business can then easily swap the PrintCore, carry on printing and let someone repair the removed one.

The NFC chips are also not encrypted. We do sign our own materials, but materials without chips will work (albeit without automatic detection).

As for slicing on the machine itself. Yes, it's theoretically possible. The main issue is RAM memory. Small objects work pretty well, but it's quite easy to slice a model that takes about 8-12 gig of ram (as we haven't tried optimising this). The ollimex definitely does not have the resources to handle that.

The printer itself also sports a REST-full API, which can remote control pretty much everything on the printer (Position of head, sending debug-code, temperatures, filament, types of printcores loaded, logfiles, time left on print, RGB leds, starting print-jobs, etc).

I don't know a whole lot about the PVA, but I don't think there is any reason as to why it's impossible to get it to work for UM2 or UM2+

The machine also has a "dev mode", in which case you can have SSH acces to the machine. This gives you complete remote control. You can indeed install extra software on the board.

As for oozing; It's a combination of a number of things. The lifting does magic. Changed hotend design works it's magic. Cura also adds a splash of magic. We can use a prime tower and for some materials we do recommend it.

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Neotko
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Re: Teaser for the New Ultimaker....here we go!

Postby Neotko » October 19th, 2016, 4:10 am

nallath wrote:As for slicing on the machine itself. Yes, it's theoretically possible. The main issue is RAM memory. Small objects work pretty well, but it's quite easy to slice a model that takes about 8-12 gig of ram (as we haven't tried optimising this). The ollimex definitely does not have the resources to handle that.


I suppose for this one could install a HD on the Sata plug and create a virtual memory of it so it can slice on a SSD drive at a very slow speed? Just thinking outloud


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